RHU Question on Loss Prevention Bag Checking

From pennyslut:

Quick question.  I understand that bag checks are legal, and from my understanding they must be conducted while the employee is clocked in.  

Today I was subject to my first-ever bag check, and I told the LP officer that I wasn't clocked in, and it was illegal to search my bag.  LP said that as long as it is under 5 minutes I don't have to be clocked in.  She began checking my items, and as she was doing so a long line began forming behind me, waiting to be checked.  

I felt bad because those people had to wait even longer, unpaid.  It was associate shopping day, so many of us bought loads of stuff (which took a while to check), and secondly, we were all hoping to beat the football traffic that was letting out down the street.  

Obviously, "under 5 minutes" adds up, especially if a line forms!  And don't worry, I documented the incident.  My question is this: Should I wait and see (and keep documenting) if it keeps occurring before I report it to corporate or even NYS labor bureau?  Or should I just casually mention it to my store manager right away so she might address the problem?

My coworkers tell me "its not a big deal", but I am very stubborn when it comes to my rights, especially when our return policy allows customers to literally steal something in front of our face and return it for cash back (we cant say a thing!), but we are treated as criminals.

--pennyslut

 

Comments

[Kay]

My vote would be to casually mention it to the manager and also keep documenting (also document what the manager says/does in response). If the problems continue then go over the store.

When you talk to the manager frame everything as concerrn for the store and not wanting your employers to get in trouble. Wide-eyed innocence is a plus.

[Retail Kiwi]

I think this shows the difference in behaviour between (i'm assuming you're american based on your name and various phrases) Americans and for instance New Zealander's because honestly I couldn't give two hoots about the management checking my bag, I do have to ask though how big is your bag if it takes 5 minutes to check it, all we do is glance inside and wave them on, granted we sell mainly larger items but still.

I think you're overreacting, if you haven't stolen anything then what do you have to hide? Complaining just makes you look guilty about something.

[Madrias]

Kiwi, it's not the fact of guilt. That whole "If you have nothing to hide, then you won't fear (insert strange rule here) because it doesn't affect you" is the traditional line used by our government.

As far as why it's wrong, it's this simple line: "Innocent until proven Guilty." Bag check = "Guilty until proven innocent, and we still think you're guilty"

[KattyBitch]

Why aren't you having your bag checked before clocking out then?

[pennyslut<33]

Kiwi, I mentioned that it was associate shopping day. So many of us had several large bags of merchandise which needed to be counted and the numbers matched up to the receipt. And if it takes them 2 minutes to check my bag everyday for a year, than that amounts to hours added up. It's about the principle, for me anyway.

KattyBitch, the LP officer stood at the employee exit, which is past the place where we clock out. I offered to clock back in, but she said that if it was under 5 minutes it did not have to be clocked in.

If that's the case and we have a 5 minute leeway, i'm going to start taking 4 minute, 59 second breaks throughout my shift!!

[Retail Kiwi]

Ah, I see, I wasn't aware of what Associate Shopping Day was, and I wasn't aware that it was your shopping that was being checked I thought it was your handbag/backpack etc... that was being checked. Slight misunderstanding there, I understand where you're coming from now.

[LadyBelle]

@Retail Kiwi, there is also a difference between areas of the US. Here, no one really cares about checking employee shopping and receipts. Personal bags or backpacks would start some serious fights and no boss who asked it would have employees. The only exception might be for someone that worked with classified information or other high security area. There would have to be an actual accusation of theft, and even then the company would more then likely call in law enforcement to be present for the check.

[Retail Kiwi]

Gotcha, where I work it's slightly different any staff shopping done on a day of a shift can only be done once the store has closed and they must be served by the manager on duty. We are also required to show our bags as we leave but that basically amounts to a quick glance inside to make sure nothings there, there are no in depth searches of any kind. Which agian explains why I was confused as to the original complaint, I can see I misunderstood what bags were being searched though.

[NumismaticNerd]

When I worked at America's Finest Traditional Amusement Park, we were given CLEAR PLASTIC BAGS (backpacks or totes, too small to carry all our things) in which to hold our stuff... Personally I'd rather no one know if I'm on the rag or (if it were now) I have hundreds of dollars of camera gear with me from school. That's just ASKING for it to be stolen... Oh yeah, employee theft doesn't count theft -from- the employee...

[Skittles]

@ Retail Kiwi
After reading over my comment I figure I should point out that my rage isn't targeting anyone in particular.

I think the biggest problem that most people have with this horse shit is that it directly violates the fourth ammendment of our fucking constitution. The fact that it isn't illegal in every single state and city is the biggest fucking pile of shit ever. It's basically saying that cororations get to make laws and that is absolutely wrong because we did not vote for them. The whole well you took the job and you are on their property doesn't work either. If I payed a cleaning service to come into my house I would never be legally allowed to frisk them down or check their bags before they left my house why the fuck do corporations get to. Stores shouldn't even get to check the bags of customers that are leaving unless having actually seen them stealing, thus giving them the authority to perform a citizens arrest. The only people who should ever get to search you ever under any circumstances are police officers, and individuals duly authorized by the government such as airport security who have to be trained first. Mind you I think airport security searching people is horse shit anyway as it will not stop terorrists anyway. To leave you all with a final thought to ponder. The police can not search you without probable cause, leaving your job at the end of the day is by no means probable cause, yet your LP or management now has more authority than the police to search you.

[lamer]

Working 5 days a week, taking 4 minutes of your time at 8.00 per hour amounts to 53 cents per day, 2.65 per week, and 137.80 per year. Once you are off the clock, they cannot require you to do anything except leave. You can point out the next in the chain of command that 137.80 is a lot per employee, but more if coupled with attorneys fees...

[pennyslut<33]

thanks for all the suggestions guys :)

[TechTiger]

Skittles, the Fourth Amendment only applies to the government, and government representatives. Basically, the reason the corporation can do it is that people allow them to do it. If you stopped allowing them, they wouldn't be able to. But they'd probably fire you, of course...

[Skittles]

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

Funny nowhere in their does it state that it only applies to the government. Regardless of that I refer to my last point, the fact that this is legal effectively give companies more power and authority than the police.

[Chicajojobe]

Bag checks at The Baby Store always occurred after we clocked out.
However, it was only days we worked. If we came into the store to shop on our days off they couldn't check our bags then.

[Chicajojobe]

@Skittles,

It's a legal loophole. They aren't doing anything illegal. You CAN refuse to let them search your bag, and they can't call the cops and have you arrested for it. Also, if they grabbed your bag out of your hands when you refused a search you could call the police because it'd technically be theft.
In at-will states, though, they can fire you for refusing to because they can fire you for pretty much any reason or no reason.
What they're doing is coercing you into giving them permission to search your bag due to the threat to your job and good standing at the company.

[The Last Archimedean]

That is precisely why at-will employment needs to be banned by federal law so that power returns in some small way to employees. You could still be fired if you screwed up but people could actually stand up for their rights.

[Skittles]

Thank you Archimedean someone gets what I am saying. If you actually read a lot of these laws you can see how poorly they are written or how easily they can be abused.